Re: Pablo is back, Job, Argentina, Relay, Lord of the Rings

----- Original Message -----
From: Stephen Mulraney <ataltanie@...>

> Scriobh Sally Caves:
> >          ...          I loved the LotR:FotR.  Legolas:
> > "Crebain from Dunland!"  (It's been a while since I've
> > read these books, but I know someone else speaks this);
> > but doesn't this look like an "Elvish" version of L. corvinus,
> > "raven"?  Or am I just fishing in the dark?  What's the
> > Irish for "raven"?
>
> "fiach dubh" /f'ax duv/ , '=palatalisation x=velar fric. voiceless.
> Actually 'fiach' alone seems to mean 'raven', as in the phrase "comh
> dubh leis an bhfiach" (with urú [lenition] of bh- on the initial f), =
> "as black as the raven" but the 'dubh' (black) seems to be part of the
> name when quoted in dictionaries etc. Similarly the blackbird is called
> "lon dubh" where "lon" = "blackbird" and "dubh"="black"! The word for
> "crow" is "préachán" /pr'e:axa:n/.
>
> So not much similar to "crebain", except the second syllable of
"préachán".
> I'd suggest that a number of these forms - crebain, corvinus, (préaCHÁN
?),
> crow, corby are slightly inspired by the sound of the bird. Though they're
> all words (except crebain?) for crow rather than raven.
I also suggested in that post that Tolkien may have unconsciously
borrowed from Middle English, which got it from French, which
got it from Latin, which yields our _twa corbies_, "two crows."

> > Did anybody else interpret these birds as other than
> > hideous Mordorish crows?
>
> Isengardish? ;)
Slapping hand to forehead.  And I've only read the book
three times and seen the movie three times.  Of course
Isengardish.  But Mordor.... reminds me of "a murder
of crows."  You know, like "a gaggle of geese?"  One
of English's weird selection of "classifiers"?

A Mordor of crows? <G>  No, from Isengard.

> Stephen Mulraney
>
> PS. The relay game looks wonderful - All I need now is a conlang! I don't
> want to rush ahead though. Just investigating other peoples', getting a
> hang of some interesting grammatical ideas ('ergativity' took a bit of
> work, but came in a flash!).
I strongly suggest that you deny yourself not one minute longer
the pleasure of inventing your own language.  You should start
right away.  Put your day job on hold and go to it!!

Sally Caves
scaves@frontiernet.net
http://www.frontiernet.net/~scaves/teoeng.html

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